NIK Collection Tip

I have been experimenting with NIK collection of filter using CS6.

If you use the NIK filters, or a planning too, you will see that each filter creates its own layer in PS. That is good, but the issue is that once the layer is created, you cannot edit it further. That's not so good.

In a conversation offline, Lon came up with a great way to ensure the filters are editable after you commit your adjustments. Basically, you create a Smart Filter in PS. Here is how...

To use NIK Filters as Smart Filters in PS, do the following:

1. Make a copy of the background layer.
2. Convert the copied background layer to a Smart Object
3. Open one of the Nik filters, adjust as needed and then click OK to apply your changes

Photo Shop creates the NIK filters as Smart Filters. You can then double-click to go back and edit. It’s pretty slick.

If you need another NIK filter, be sure the Converted BG layer is selected and then repeat step #3.

If you have a tip for using the NIK Collection, please share it by posting to this thread. 
--P

Great tip! I've been messing with those too since they've been made free. It's a bit overwhelming honestly, with all the options, but this should be useful.

Thanks, Preston and Lon, for this great tip! I've been using the Nik suite for years and have occasionally found it a nuisance that you can't tweak the layers; it's been a matter of either adding another layer or deleting the original filter layer and starting over. But this is very useful indeed.  Hmm ... hopefully it should work in CS5 since that's what I use.

Great tip, Preston.  I've rarely used the NIK filters, but I use a couple of the Topaz filters regularly and have the same issue.  I think I'll try this on the Topaz system next time I'm editing and see if it will work.  I'll report back.

I'm a long-time user of Nik (pre-Google). The Viveza 2 filter, in particular, is very good. The DFine is an above-average noise reduction tool. But I caution that it's not clear Google will be supporting Nik on Windows 10 or Mac OS greater than 10.10.

I caution that it's not clear Google will be supporting Nik on Windows 10 

I am using the NIK collection on Win 10 Build 1511 (The Nov 2015 release) and have not seen any issues thus far. Of course, that does not mean there won't be in the future as MS offers new builds.

It is my hope that Google will continue to support the 'collection', because many have, and will, find it valuable.
--P

So far, I like the pre-sharperning and noise reduction filters.  What I'm not fond of yet are all the "preset" templates, like in Silver EFex. It makes this application seem like a very old, almost Pre-PS, PS Elements type application where you have a few dozen templates, you click on it and whala, you have a Sepia toned image!  Nothing to really assist in the why, how, or what am I doing to the pixels kind of approach. Like using the fancy camera apps on our phones - touch this for Starry night, or this button for "old time photo," etc.  Of course it's just the way I like to operate, but I like to have complete control; yes, I realize the templates do have sliders for reducing or enhancing the effects, but still, it just feels like a camera phone app (for some of the tools..)

The other down side is file size creep.  I start with a 40Mb RAW file, and with just one or two filters (and that bg layer copy) and pretty soon we're talking 700Mb!  Add some TK layers and now we're talking Gigs!  (I just ordered an SSD and I'm doubling my RAM to help ease the pain.)

In the end, NIK is another tool in the Tool bag.  I will use some of the filters for some images that I want to process quick and easy, and continue with Tony's actions and masks for more complicated and careful processing.

Lon

Add some TK layers and now we're talking Gigs!

Lon:  If you are seeing a huge increase in file size from TK, the most likely culprit is that you are creating a bunch of extra channels and not removing them.  The adjustment layers from TK with the masks increase the file size, but not but any dramatic measure.  There are buttons in the TK interface to remove the extra channels, or just go in and remove them on your own.  I always warn students about this when I teach my TK class.

 

Lon and Keith,

I looked at one of my images that contained only NIK filters as Smart Filters.

The filters I used are:

1. Dfine
2. RAW Pre-sharpener
3. Viveza
4. Color Efex

The original NEF RAW file is 27.1 MB. The PSD file is 866 MB @ 360 ppi. This is an 838.9 MB difference. The only channels in the 'Channels Palette' are RGB, R, G, and B. There are no alpha channels.

With a 'Clone' layer (Layer>New...) and TK's Burn/Dodge layer, the file size increases to 1,200 MB.

Honestly, I never really checked to see the increase in file size using only TK's masks. My normal workflow is to load his masks as either Levels or Curves, which do not create alpha channels. If I do create masks as alpha channels, and create (say) a Curves layer, I delete the alpha channel once I know I no longer need it.

Based upon this quick look, the copy of the background layer, and the Nik filters (as Smart Filters) cause a pretty dramatic increase in file size. Throw in pixel-containing layers, such as TK's masks, and things can get real big in a hurry, as Lon says.

Research Continues...
--P

That sounds very large.  The 27.1mb RAW file is not the size of the file that will be opened after the RAW file is de-mosaiced.  I looked at the raw file I used for this example.  It was 26.5 mb as a RAW (CR2).  After opening in PS it was 122mb.  

I'm attaching a layer stack similar to what you described.  The background was converted to a smart object, then 4 NIK filters applied as you described.  Then a clone layer, then a TK dodge layer.

Saved it as a PSD.  Size on disk is 414.5 mb.  

Are you cloning on a blank layer? or are you creating a duplicate pixel bearing layer?

No additional channels as you described as well.

I'm attaching a copy of the layer stack.

 

I think I spoke prematurely and added some confusion.  The file that grew to 1.2G has no association with TK layers, I was just making a comment that with all these adjustments, NIK, TK included, that the file sizes are getting enormous.



Thanks for the reminder of the Channels Keith. I am aware of that, but frankly get lazy and don't always check.  But also, you made me think about this further and this is what I mean by being premature, making assumptions that NIK was causing the file size to explode.



I'll be the first to admit - and plead ignorance because I've only been working on files from RAW/ACR for less than 5 months and I won't pretend to know how this works.  But here is what I see with an example file of mine:



RAW nef file from D800E = ~50Mb

RAW opened ACR, opened as Smart Object in PSCC, Saved PSD = 443Mb (BOOM!)

+NIK (pre sharpener, Viveza, Defin2, Color Efex) on bg layer, saved PSD = 605Mb

+TK, 2 Lum Masks, Burn, Vibrance, No Channels except RGB = 855Mb



Lesson learned here is the signficant growth in file size is merely opening up a RAW file in PS and saving as a PSD. Also, relative to the original file size and subsequent PSD size, both NIK and some LUM masks from TK do grow the file size, but aren't necessarily the culprit for making these files so large.



Keith I'm sure you know this and I'm sure I could Google this.... but why would a file jump from 50 to 443Mb without doing anything by saving it?  I'm pretty sure converting to a Smart Object has an effect, it's gotta store history and information within the file.  



I suppose I could try opening from ACR without converting to a Smart Object.

Edit, OK, opening as just an image from ACR and NOT a Smart Object, file Saves As PSD = 207MB
Then Duplicate bg layer, convert to Smart Object, save as PSD = drum roll....... 975Mb!  holy crap.

Very Interesting results, gents.

I ran a test starting with an NEF Raw file. After adding eac layer, or filter I saved the image and recorded the resulting file size

• RAW File 33.5 MB
• Open ACR and then Open in CS6 as NEF, save as PSD 137 MB
• Copy Background Layer. Convert to Smart Object 778 MB
• Add Nik DeFine 908 MB
• Add Nik Viveza 908 MB
• Add Nik Color Efex 908 MB
• Add Nik Color Efex w/ one control Point 908 MB
• Add TK Lights Mask (Levels) 954 MB
• Add TK Burn/Dodge Layer w/ 50% grey fill and two small areas of 10% burn/dodge 1,110 MB

My results are in line with Lon's. I find it interesting that the Viveza and Color Efex filters have little or no impact on file size. The NR in Define definitely does (130 MB). The impact on file size by TK's Lights mask was not very large (46 MB), but the TK Burn/Dodge layer' impact was 156 MB, which surprised me.

I have not tried RAW open in ACR, open as Smart Object in CS6 and then save as PSD. If I did, my result would likely be in line with Lon's.

Other than merging the Background Copy Smart Object with the Background layer once one is happy with the their NIK adjustments, I cannot really a way to prevent file size bloat. Personally, I try to keep my file sizes under 2 GB.

As far as performance goes, I have not had any issues. This machine has 32 GB of RAM under Windows 10. I will have to do further testing to see what is happening with CPU usage and RAM usage when using the NIK filters.

As I always say, "Research Continues..."
--P

Keith I'm sure you know this and I'm sure I could Google this.... but why would a file jump from 50 to 443Mb without doing anything by saving it?  I'm pretty sure converting to a Smart Object has an effect, it's gotta store history and information within the file.  

The "jump" from 50mb to 443mb sounds very large, but a RAW file is not even an image file.  It is simply raw data captured from the sensor.  The RAW processing engine has to de-mosaic the RAW file to turn it into an image, hence the significant increase in file size.

Looking at the results from Preston's layer stack.  A couple of comments.  There is no value added in duplicating the background layer, then converting it to a Smart Object.  That will just increase the size and has no impact on the all important concept of non-destructive PS editing.  Just convert the background layer to a smart object if the desire is to use a smart object.

Looking at the Burn/Dodge layer from TK.  Looks like an older version of TK as I can see from the thumbnail that the layer is filled with 50% gray.  There is no need to fill the layer with 50% gray.  The blending mode used, "Soft Light" (and "Overlay") ignore 50% gray, but filling the layer with 50% gray pixels is still adding to the file size.  PS doesn't care whether the layer has "real" image pixels or full of 50% gray pixels, they are both still pixels.  Just create an empty layer, set the blending mode and do the same work with Dodge/Burn.  Then the only added pixels are the ones that are painted onto the layer with either White or Black.
 

A question from the, obviously, uninformed.  What is "TK" and why should I care?

John, TK is the initials for Tony Kuyper. He is the developer of the TK masks we often mention.

Take a look, Here. You can see the tutorials, Here.

Tony has created various actions for Photo Shop. The most popular ones are his Luminosity Masks. Basically, the actions create masks on either a curves or levels layer that are self-feathering. Using them makes it easy to control various tonal ranges in your image without having to make complex selections. They are worth a serious look.
--P
 

There is no value added in duplicating the background layer, then converting it to a Smart Object.  That will just increase the size and has no impact on the all important concept of non-destructive PS editing.  Just convert the background layer to a smart object if the desire is to use a smart object.

Excellent! Thanks for sharing this, Keith. I was not aware the background layer could be converted to a Smart Object. Imagine that! I learn something new every day here!

I will also take a look at your tip about the Burn/Dodge Layer. My set of TK's actions is quite old. Thanks again!
--P
 

I have been experimenting again with workflow using the NIK Plugins.

It appears that reducing file size bloat is best achieved by doing the following:

1. Open the RAW file in ACR and make any adjustments, including cropping**
2. Hold the Shift key and click 'Open Image'. This step opens the image in PS as a Smart Object.
3. In Photo Shop select the newly created Smart Object layer.
4. If desired, apply Raw Pre-sharpener using Sharpener Pro 3.
5. Apply noise reduction using Dfine 2
6. Control color and light using Viveza 2
7. Adjust and then apply any of the other Nik plugins you need
8. Create any other PS adjustment layers you need above the Smart Object layer.

I have found it best to turn off sharpening and noise reduction in ACR before opening the image in PS. The RAW Pre-sharpener and Define plugins allow for better control in these cases.

The file size of the image in the screen shot is 743.7 MB.

So far, this is the best I can come up with. If any of you have a more efficient way of working with the Nik plugins, I am up for hearing them.

--P

There is some great info in the entire thread...thanks for sharing. I used NIK a lot when I got the suite a few years ago but am less enamored with it lately. Mostly because my PS skills have increased but I also recently learned that NIK converts the file to 8bit and once there, there is no going back. I still use them but less often. Silver Efex is very good but I agree with Lon the presets seem archaic but I can still render a better BW with NIK than I can in PS.
 

Bruce wrote: "I also recently learned that NIK converts the file to 8 bit and once there, there is no going back."

Hmmm? I just just checked four images that were saved as PSD files where I used NIK. They all show as being 16 bit (Image>Mode in PS) . You might want to check your Save settings in ACR, or your RAW converter, and NIK to be sure the files are saved as 16 bit.

Nik does seem to be a bit archaic, but it was designed for folks who do not possess advanced skills in Photo Shop or for those who want nice results within a minimum amount of time.

The Silver Efex plugin does do a nice job for making B&W versions, though.

--P