. . . If sometimes we are preaching to the choir? I wonder if an idea like participating with a sister site, a site that has nature lovers but not nature photography as it's main focus ,might be a good idea. For example , sharing of information, asking for opinions that kinda thing.
Why I think this exchange of ideas and opinions may be of great benifit to NPN, is that we could receive, hopefully, some comments from non photographers on our images, which I suspect might yield some surprising and valuable results.
Afterall, how many images do you sell to other photographers?
Gaining an insight into the reasons why a more general audience admires certain images may be far different than what we hold near and dear; technique, light quality, sharpness etc.
Have you ever seen certain images published in a magazine or book, along with other , what you would consider to be " very good" work, and it's grainy, or out of focus, over exposed or some other "defect" that you know would be picked apart here, and wonder "how the heck did that get published?"
Perhaps particiapting with a "sister site " would answer that question and others as well. Plus, I think we, as a group would have alot to offer the other site by particpating in some of their forums
and exchange of thoughts and ideas.
I was just wondering Jim and others if you had ever considered this?
Thanks , Tim
Posted by Richard Wong on April 30, 2006 at 12:23 AM
Sounds like a good idea if I'm understanding you correctly. Something like a cross promotional deal with Sierra Club, state park visitor centers, the GORP website, etc...
"how the heck did that get published?" Everything is subjective and I'm guessing most of these types of images are usually within the context of a story which makes them appropriate. One of my favorite photographers is Bill Allard and a lot of his technique might be called barely adequate on a forum like this but that's his style and his work conveys emotion that more polished work doesn't have. It's kind of like do you prefer pop music or blues. I happen to like both.
I agree Richard, about the published photos, in fact I think I'm far more interested in things that fall into the realm of ideas or message that an image represents. However you don't really hear that discussed much in the critique forums. I'm just wondering if our evaulation process is so focused on conventional technique that we are missing part of the bigger picture? ( Pardon the puns ! ) Tim
Posted by Randy Beacham on April 30, 2006 at 6:33 AM
Hi Tim, I don't know how much trouble, or work, that might be to pull off but I think it's a fascinationg idea--the thought that we photographers might be critiqued by non-photographing nature lovers. Randy
Posted by Jim Erhardt on April 30, 2006 at 11:13 AM
An interesting idea, which at this moment has the gears turning in my feeble brain.
Another point to consider Jim, is that this type of cross participation may attract more people to become members here at NPN and likewise for the other site. I would think that an announcement at both sites to introduce the idea might be enough to get the ball rolling, perhaps a thread in this forum welcoming the new viewers as well, that type of thing.
One suggestion I would have, is to pair with a nature site that is quite general in scope, not one that is solely focused on one aspect, for example; conservation. I think the broader the participants experience the more that would reflect our "real life" audience.
Just think how much the other site may benefit too ! There are some amazing people here, who have alot to offer, wisdom, experience, knowledge . . . oh yeah, there's a few OK photographers also ! Everyone knows this the best nature photography site , and it has alot to do with the people and the manner in which they participate, not just the images themselves. Of course no one knows that better than you! Tim
Posted by Kelly Rowe on April 30, 2006 at 12:51 PM
The Nature Conservancy seems to fit well with NPN. It's international, and focuses on all types of wildlife and habitat, just as we do.
Posted by Drew Fulton on April 30, 2006 at 1:37 PM
I love this idea. Like Jim, my mind is churning away. Gimme a couple days and let me get some stuff off my plate and I will be back with some more concrete ideas.
Posted by Tony Kuyper on April 30, 2006 at 2:29 PM
I'd like to see a pairing with a poetry or writing site. I think we could inspire each other.
This is a very interesting idea. I for one would enjoy the input from other s and also enjoylearning a new perspective on nature. I agree that a broad based site would benefit most. This kind of creative thinking is what makes this site so special.
In a way you can each do this on your on. Mention this site if you are on a bird site or a tree site or a flower site. Maby they might point you or us to a owl nest, or odd tree, or a field of flowers that is just out of site of a main road. Reward people that help you out with a 8x10 of something they told you about.But I think its a cool idea.
Cindy wrote - "I like Tony's idea- I've written poetry/haiku for many years and often write one in my nature journal after I've been out on a shoot that was inspirational to me. (Which most are) "
I like Tony's idea too. I was thinking of this in regards to selling/ displaying photographs, but it makes sense from a practical standpoint too, because many people wish to write articles and perhaps even a book containing their images.
" And as far as purchasing photos from other photographers- I've purchased images from no less than 4 NPN members... and have a few more I would like once I pay my medical bills"
Well that might be true, and perhaps many other phorographers have bought images of yours. However my point is that in either case it is probably a low percntage of the whole, photographers buying and selling to each other. In fact though here at NPN , almost 100% of the feedback and critiques are from other photographers and yet, in most cases most of the sales and exhibiting is to a more general group , I would think.
"I feel if a person is critiquing, they should be an NPN member.. There are so many photography forums out there and I'd hate to see NPN loose it's vision, which to me is currently right on track."
I completely disagree with the above, in fact, to my understanding, it's not a requirement now, is it? Also please note, I'm not saying we should sister with another photography site, just the opposite in fact.
" And on Robert's thought, I gave a photo to a newspaper columnist for no charge last year ( a bald headed r.w. blackbird and she was doing a column on mites/molting) and that contact led to a publisher contacting me to do a field guide on moths in 2007. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I would make a substantial amount of $$ for something that I enjoy and have put alot of work into just because I happen to be intrigued by moths.
What goes around, comes around :) "
Well that's great, congratulations. It just goes to show you, the more contacts you make the more opportunities that may arise!
Discussion
12 repliesWhy I think this exchange of ideas and opinions may be of great benifit to NPN, is that we could receive, hopefully, some comments from non photographers on our images, which I suspect might yield some surprising and valuable results.
Afterall, how many images do you sell to other photographers?
Gaining an insight into the reasons why a more general audience admires certain images may be far different than what we hold near and dear; technique, light quality, sharpness etc.
Have you ever seen certain images published in a magazine or book, along with other , what you would consider to be " very good" work, and it's grainy, or out of focus, over exposed or some other "defect" that you know would be picked apart here, and wonder "how the heck did that get published?"
Perhaps particiapting with a "sister site " would answer that question and others as well. Plus, I think we, as a group would have alot to offer the other site by particpating in some of their forums
and exchange of thoughts and ideas.
I was just wondering Jim and others if you had ever considered this?
Thanks , Tim
"how the heck did that get published?" Everything is subjective and I'm guessing most of these types of images are usually within the context of a story which makes them appropriate. One of my favorite photographers is Bill Allard and a lot of his technique might be called barely adequate on a forum like this but that's his style and his work conveys emotion that more polished work doesn't have. It's kind of like do you prefer pop music or blues. I happen to like both.
One suggestion I would have, is to pair with a nature site that is quite general in scope, not one that is solely focused on one aspect, for example; conservation. I think the broader the participants experience the more that would reflect our "real life" audience.
Just think how much the other site may benefit too ! There are some amazing people here, who have alot to offer, wisdom, experience, knowledge . . . oh yeah, there's a few OK photographers also !
I like Tony's idea too. I was thinking of this in regards to selling/ displaying photographs, but it makes sense from a practical standpoint too, because many people wish to write articles and perhaps even a book containing their images.
" And as far as purchasing photos from other photographers- I've purchased images from no less than 4 NPN members... and have a few more I would like once I pay my medical bills"
Well that might be true, and perhaps many other phorographers have bought images of yours. However my point is that in either case it is probably a low percntage of the whole, photographers buying and selling to each other. In fact though here at NPN , almost 100% of the feedback and critiques are from other photographers and yet, in most cases most of the sales and exhibiting is to a more general group , I would think.
"I feel if a person is critiquing, they should be an NPN member.. There are so many photography forums out there and I'd hate to see NPN loose it's vision, which to me is currently right on track."
I completely disagree with the above, in fact, to my understanding, it's not a requirement now, is it? Also please note, I'm not saying we should sister with another photography site, just the opposite in fact.
" And on Robert's thought, I gave a photo to a newspaper columnist for no charge last year ( a bald headed r.w. blackbird and she was doing a column on mites/molting) and that contact led to a publisher contacting me to do a field guide on moths in 2007. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I would make a substantial amount of $$ for something that I enjoy and have put alot of work into just because I happen to be intrigued by moths.
What goes around, comes around :) "
Well that's great, congratulations. It just goes to show you, the more contacts you make the more opportunities that may arise!
Thanks, Tim
I also like Tony's idea. This could be windfall of benefit for both.