Posted by Jay Defigh on January 8, 2010 at 2:28 AM
Hi all,
This will be my first ever display. I would very much appreciate access to your expertise.
A friend of mine asked me to take photos of an art event at a cafe she owns, in which various artists will be showcasing and selling their work. The photos will be used on her website, and magazine quality images are not required. She's offered to let me put up my photos on display, along with the other artists.
The question is, I'm not sure I'll be able to take photos and answer questions at the same time. Do you think it's a bad idea to agree to do both? There are supposed to be about 200 people showing up during the event. Also, I'm not sure if I should charge her for taking photos. I threw out a sum of $20/hr (say photograph 3 hours to leave time for me to stand by my displayed pics) which I feel to be very reasonable, but am considering just doing it for free, since she's allowing me to display my work.
I'd very much appreciate any advice you can give.
Thank you!!
Posted by Jim Sabiston on January 8, 2010 at 10:53 AM
Jay,
I've done events like this, so I may be able to offer some insights. There is no 'fixed' standard, so you have to make your own decisions. My own approach, if my work is also on display and the organizer is a friend of mine, is not to charge unless there is a sure profit for the organizer from the event (or it is otherwise business related). Another consideration is how much experience do you have photographing an event. I had very little, so used these events as an opportunity to learn and not charging a fee keeps some of the pressure off.
These events can be both fun and a great opportunity to meet and network with other artists and potential clients. You can use the event photography as an opener to call attention to your own work as you move about the crowd and supplying photos of the event to your friend generates good will, all reasons to apply less attention to charging a fee.
All this also gives me something to do at these events!
In the end, you will have to use your own judgement. I do not rely on my photography as a major income source, so the minor income at question here is of relatively little importance to me. The real value is exposure and experience.
We run along approximately the same lines as Jim in events like this in which our own work is on display, too. And I wouldn't worry too much about shooting and socializing at the same time. That's what happens on almost any location shoot, because there are always people around and they want to watch and talk to you.
I will add an insight, though. We charge little or not at all because we see it as a promotional event, at which the other artists are prospects. Most serious artists need photos of their own work for their own promotions and web sites PLUS they need top notch photos of their work for entering in competitions. We derive significant income from other artists in our studio, so the opportunity to "strut our stuff" with a bunch of them is definitely a business opportunity with value above and beyond fees payed by the event sponsor.
In that light, we put a whole lot of thought and effort into our shooting, and it's not just casual "walk around" or documentary photography. Scope out the location before the crowd arrives and do some test shooting. How high are the ceilings? Can you bounce a strobe? That will give you the best results on shooting the other art. If no bounce, use a reflector or small soft box and off-camera cable to elevate the strobe and drive the shadows down behind it and the people. We're an established business with a full-service studio and published rates, so I'm not going to quote what we charge. But the potential fees for subsequently shooting the artists' work along with the opportunity to showcase my own work and myself at work has lots of value. I'd certainly take any fees from the sponsor, but wouldn't feel shorted without them, considering the opportunities.
Heck, the other artists just might be interested in buying photos of their work you took at the show, over and above best quality studio shots. It's a winner all around in my book! Shots of people admiring their work in public settings are hard to come by. Just carry model releases and get the people admiring the work to sign them so their photo can be used in later artist promotions.
Posted by Jay Defigh on January 8, 2010 at 1:37 PM
Jim and Hank, thank you very much for providing great insights into this situation. I'll tell her I'll do it for free and will try to get there and practice shooting to see how feasible bouncing is.
I do not have a lot of experience shooting events (assisted at a couple of weddings), so this will be good practice as you said, Jim. A model release is a great idea, too.
One question, Hank: In this case the photos would go to my friend, and would likely include shots of people staring at the art. She may want to give those to the artists. However, if I were to make money from shooting, I'd have to explain to her that she can't give any photos to the artists, but instead allow me to sell the pics to them, or have her sign a contract prohibiting her from giving them away to the artists (seems a little over the top in this case). How do you normally work around this potential sticking point?
I just make that a condition of shooting the event for free or reduced fee. If she tells the other artists up front that you're the official photographer and copies can be purchased directly from you, no probs. As long as everyone understands the rules up front, there shouldn't be any sticking points. The other artists are certainly welcome to shoot their own, but after seeing your well-thought-out and executed images against their own, I bet it generates more sales rather than less.
The biggest thing is to relax and have fun. Pre-scouting and a little practice shooting will take away a lot of the stress, and make that possible.
BTW-
Don't hesitate to pose viewers of specific art work. That's an easy way to get around collecting releases from every Tom, Dick and Harry. Your "models" will have lots of fun along with you, if you do it right. And the fun will come through in the photos for better results.
Posted by Jim Sabiston on January 10, 2010 at 5:10 PM
Hank,
Some very good points for me as well! I especially like the 'models' approach. Excellent suggestion.
And both Jim and Jay, don't overlook the potential for "residual" sales. For some time after, the artists may be coming to you for photos of people admiring their work. It's very useful for their own websites and promo efforts.
We're in the midst of very lucrative residual sales from an industrial shoot we did last fall. Even though we were well payed by the four principal contractors for both the shooting and photo licenses, we have had a steady stream of other companies needing photos from the shoot. And that's the value in retaining rights to the photos and licensing their use, rather than simply handing them over at the end of a shoot. Unless there are bans or prohibitions spelled out in the initial contract (and compensated), you're free to make subsequent sales. I think it's a very good comparison for Jay's upcoming shoot.
Discussion
6 repliesThis will be my first ever display. I would very much appreciate access to your expertise.
A friend of mine asked me to take photos of an art event at a cafe she owns, in which various artists will be showcasing and selling their work. The photos will be used on her website, and magazine quality images are not required. She's offered to let me put up my photos on display, along with the other artists.
The question is, I'm not sure I'll be able to take photos and answer questions at the same time. Do you think it's a bad idea to agree to do both? There are supposed to be about 200 people showing up during the event. Also, I'm not sure if I should charge her for taking photos. I threw out a sum of $20/hr (say photograph 3 hours to leave time for me to stand by my displayed pics) which I feel to be very reasonable, but am considering just doing it for free, since she's allowing me to display my work.
I'd very much appreciate any advice you can give.
Thank you!!
I've done events like this, so I may be able to offer some insights. There is no 'fixed' standard, so you have to make your own decisions. My own approach, if my work is also on display and the organizer is a friend of mine, is not to charge unless there is a sure profit for the organizer from the event (or it is otherwise business related). Another consideration is how much experience do you have photographing an event. I had very little, so used these events as an opportunity to learn and not charging a fee keeps some of the pressure off.
These events can be both fun and a great opportunity to meet and network with other artists and potential clients. You can use the event photography as an opener to call attention to your own work as you move about the crowd and supplying photos of the event to your friend generates good will, all reasons to apply less attention to charging a fee.
All this also gives me something to do at these events!
In the end, you will have to use your own judgement. I do not rely on my photography as a major income source, so the minor income at question here is of relatively little importance to me. The real value is exposure and experience.
Hope that helps a little bit.
I will add an insight, though. We charge little or not at all because we see it as a promotional event, at which the other artists are prospects. Most serious artists need photos of their own work for their own promotions and web sites PLUS they need top notch photos of their work for entering in competitions. We derive significant income from other artists in our studio, so the opportunity to "strut our stuff" with a bunch of them is definitely a business opportunity with value above and beyond fees payed by the event sponsor.
In that light, we put a whole lot of thought and effort into our shooting, and it's not just casual "walk around" or documentary photography. Scope out the location before the crowd arrives and do some test shooting. How high are the ceilings? Can you bounce a strobe? That will give you the best results on shooting the other art. If no bounce, use a reflector or small soft box and off-camera cable to elevate the strobe and drive the shadows down behind it and the people. We're an established business with a full-service studio and published rates, so I'm not going to quote what we charge. But the potential fees for subsequently shooting the artists' work along with the opportunity to showcase my own work and myself at work has lots of value. I'd certainly take any fees from the sponsor, but wouldn't feel shorted without them, considering the opportunities.
Heck, the other artists just might be interested in buying photos of their work you took at the show, over and above best quality studio shots. It's a winner all around in my book! Shots of people admiring their work in public settings are hard to come by. Just carry model releases and get the people admiring the work to sign them so their photo can be used in later artist promotions.
I do not have a lot of experience shooting events (assisted at a couple of weddings), so this will be good practice as you said, Jim. A model release is a great idea, too.
One question, Hank: In this case the photos would go to my friend, and would likely include shots of people staring at the art. She may want to give those to the artists. However, if I were to make money from shooting, I'd have to explain to her that she can't give any photos to the artists, but instead allow me to sell the pics to them, or have her sign a contract prohibiting her from giving them away to the artists (seems a little over the top in this case). How do you normally work around this potential sticking point?
The biggest thing is to relax and have fun. Pre-scouting and a little practice shooting will take away a lot of the stress, and make that possible.
BTW-
Don't hesitate to pose viewers of specific art work. That's an easy way to get around collecting releases from every Tom, Dick and Harry. Your "models" will have lots of fun along with you, if you do it right. And the fun will come through in the photos for better results.
Some very good points for me as well! I especially like the 'models' approach. Excellent suggestion.
And both Jim and Jay, don't overlook the potential for "residual" sales. For some time after, the artists may be coming to you for photos of people admiring their work. It's very useful for their own websites and promo efforts.
We're in the midst of very lucrative residual sales from an industrial shoot we did last fall. Even though we were well payed by the four principal contractors for both the shooting and photo licenses, we have had a steady stream of other companies needing photos from the shoot. And that's the value in retaining rights to the photos and licensing their use, rather than simply handing them over at the end of a shoot. Unless there are bans or prohibitions spelled out in the initial contract (and compensated), you're free to make subsequent sales. I think it's a very good comparison for Jay's upcoming shoot.